Winter Fuel Allowance for Everyone? Or only those who need it?

[Simon7685]

I have just watched the One Show on BBC1, in it was an article about the winter fuel allowance. It was presented by William G Stewart. For those that don't know, he is the guy who presented the auiz show 15 to 1 among other things.

 

In the article he was suggesting that the winter fuel allowance should be subject to some type of means test. He openly admits that he doesn't need help to heat his home, as he has what he described as a 6 figure income every year. He gives his £250 to charity every year, as he says do a number of other over 60 celebrities or those better off than most.

 

Anyway it got me thinking that a good old CAG debate on what we all actually think about it was in order.

 

My position?

 

Well I have to agree, if you have a 6 figure income or more than say 30k in income each year, why would you need help to keep warm? Also I am amazed when I think about it that the government is paying this money without a second thought, yet goes to the ends of the earth to stop a lot of people getting other benefits they do need.

 

Incidently he stated that there are over 100 sitting MP's that receive this money every year but then again we all know they definately need the money:eek:

[loopinlouie]

I agree. I wonder though wether they would do make it means tested or just cancel it entirely:rolleyes: Also I dont think expats should get it if in warmer climates, apparantly they still get it. But thats probably another can of worms as some argue walmer climes have feircer winters, but not all countries are like that.

If a person with no entitlement to live in this country can be seen cuddling a 36 inch telly and told can claim benefits for the fact the kids are schooled here when should be deported and the only link to this country was a brief relationship with eu national and no contributions paid in, I feel somethings seriously wrong. Whilst genuine clamiants have to fight for every penny belittled by atos and made to feel like falling apart when the forms arrive and yet this new loophole within eu will open the floodgates to most imigrants who happen to have kids schooled here, I fear we are bug*er*d, of course they will do a lot to get their kids schooled here I believe.

 

Please correct me if got some of my facts wrong, get confused easily. But I think I have made a good point for once I think

Edited February 24, 2010 by loopinlouie

[loopinlouie]

It must be frustrating for the dwp also to see needed money going elsewhere to people who dont need it or shouldnt be here xx

[ErikaPNP]

There are a few types of benefit that aren't means tested whatsover. Victoria and David Beckham are perfectly entitled to claim child benefit for their children for example, as there is no upper income limit.

 

Immigrants generally do not get to stay here funded by benefit simply because their children are in school here. EU citizens must be "self sufficient" initially and if a claim to benefit is made, they must satisfy the HRT test.

 

I agree with you wholeheartedly Loopy that there are so many people in financial dire straits who could do with the help that is being provided to people who can fund it themselves.

[antone]

The idea that there are armies of immigrants claiming money for 36 inch TVs is superficially appealing, but false. As Erika points out, habitual residence tests are applied to immigrants, and also to British citizens in some cases.

 

Still, there are clearly problems in terms of benefits not getting to people who really need them. The main argument in favour of simply paying certain benefits to everyone that means testing is an administrative nightmare, and costly to deal with. Not sure I buy it, but that's the official line.

[Simon7685]

I appreciate what you say about an administrative nightmare, having done my time so to speak as a civil servant. I know only too well what it was like then (12 years ago) and can imagine it is doubly so now.

 

However there must a simple way to administrate who qualifies for the winter fuel payment and you would hope that the savings would more than cover the administrative cost. £250 for over 60, rising to £400 for those over 80 must amount to quite a tidy sum, especially as there are more people over 60 in this country than ever before (also more over 80). I am sure that someone even on this site could come up with a cost efficient way that would be fair?

 

The thing that galls me more than anything is, I like a large number of others that have worked for long enough, get struck down with ill health and are subjected to shambolic treatment by the DWP. You have to fight for every penny you get, go through all sorts of tests, medicals and then endless appeals before you get what you should have got in the first place. Why, because the bottom line is the government wants to save the money and not pay it out unless it really has to. Yet they willingly give this money to thousands of people who do not need it, I can not see how that can be right or logical?

 

I have just quickly worked out the following;

If 10000 over 60's didn't qualify because of income & 5000 over 80's, that would come out at £4500000. Given the numbers are liable to be considerably higher, this a quite obscene amount of money that the government is giving away. Money that could be given to those who actually need it.

[loopinlouie]

I am not suggesting they are claiming for 36inch tvs, but you can be sure their benefits obviously paid for it and thats the picture they are trying to paint. Point I was making is that she wont be the only one claiming now in this way you can bet and whilst this goes on the penisoners and disabled have to battle to prove they need help.