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    • Write to us at PO Box 82112 London N17 1LG Registered Office Unit 1.01, Hollinwood Business Centre, Albert Street, Failsworth, Oldham, England, OL8 3QL
    • Is this the correct email to send WS to the courts? I was sure there was a thread here with updated emails. [email protected] Thanks again Andy
    • Thanks again Andy. I have used the following. Not 100% sure on it as it's a bit technical for me. But hopefully shines a light on the points I want to enforce of the 'Full and final' settlement.   Exhibit 2: (relevant extracts used).   URL:https://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKHL/2001/8.html Cite as: [2001] 1 All ER 961, [2001] ICR 337, [2001] 2 WLR 735, [2002] AC 251, [2002] 1 AC 251, [2001] Emp LR 359, [2001] IRLR 292, [2001] UKHL 8   Bank of Credit and Commerce International SA v. Munawar Ali, Sultana Runi Khan and Others [2001] UKHL 8; [2001] 1 All ER 961; [2001] 2 WLR 735 (1st March, 2001) HOUSE OF LORDS Lord Bingham of Cornhill Lord Browne-Wilkinson Lord Nicholls of Birkenhead Lord Hoffmann Lord Clyde OPINIONS OF THE LORDS OF APPEAL FOR JUDGMENT IN THE CAUSE BANK OF CREDIT AND COMMERCE INTERNATIONAL SA (IN COMPULSORY LIQUIDATION) (APPELLANTS) v. (1) MUNAWAR ALI (2) SULTANA RUNI KHAN AND OTHERS (RESPONDENTS) ON 1 MARCH 2001 [2001] UKHL 8   LORD NICHOLLS OF BIRKENHEAD 22. This appeal raises a question of interpretation of a general release. By a general release I mean an agreement containing widely drawn general words releasing all claims one party may have against the other. The release given by Mr Naeem was of this character. Mr Naeem accepted a payment from BCCI 'in full and final settlement of all or any claims . . . of whatsoever nature that exist or may exist'. LORD HOFFMANN 38. The language of the document is very wide. The impression it conveys is that the draftsman meant business. He has gone to some trouble to avoid leaving anything out. He uses traditional style: pairs of words like "full and final settlement", "all or any claims", "that exist or may exist" and phrases like "whether under statute, common law or in equity" and "of whatsoever nature". Admittedly, he could have gone further. Tudor Grange Holdings Ltd v Citibank NA [1992] Ch 53, 57 contains an even more elaborate release and I have seen American documents in which the release covers an entire page. But most people in this country would regard this as overkill. The modern English tradition, while still erring on the side of caution, is to avoid the grosser excesses of verbiage and trust to the judges to use common sense to get the message. I think that this tendency should be encouraged. So I think that anyone who was simply reading the document without preconceptions would accept that the draftsman was not leaving deliberate gaps. It does not however follow that the language was to be read completely literally. There may be limitations in scope to be inferred from the background, limitations from context which the draftsman may have thought too obvious to mention. But that is a different matter from saying that he did not use enough words. LORD CLYDE The critical words are: "The applicant agrees to accept the terms set out in the documents attached in full and final settlement of all or any claims whether under statute, common law or in equity of whatsoever nature that exist or may exist and, in particular, all or any claims rights or applications of whatsoever nature that the applicant has or may have or has made or could make in or to the industrial tribunal, except the applicant's rights under the respondent's pension scheme."
    • change 4 options to  a. Provide a copy agreement/facility arrangement along with the Terms and conditions at inception, which this claim is based on. b. Provide a copy of the Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand /Recall Notice and Notice of Assignment. c. Provide a breakdown of their excessive charging/fees levied to the account and quantify how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed. d. Evidence how they have complied with sections III & IV of Practice Direction - Pre-action Conduct.   add in: add a new point 2. (old one now being 3)  2. The Claimant has not complied with paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) Failed to serve a letter of claim pre claim pursuant to PAPDC changes of the 1st October 2017.It is respectfully requested that the court take this into consideration pursuant to 7.1 PAPDC.  
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

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      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
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I've got a outstanding Argos store card debt of less than £900.

I was signed off work before Christmas with anxiety etc and informed Argos/FRS and was asked to send sick note which I did.

 

My arrears at the time on the total debt were £150 and I've been paying £20 each & every month,

I know its approx. half of the minimum payment they want but it has been paid.

 

I asked argos to accept this amount but they wanted a detailed income etc form completed and I mean detailed, and didn't fill it out.

 

 

I'm in arrears with my electric which is a priority debt and they have been brilliant dealing with everything by email

as I'm finding it hard to talk on the phone at the moment. Yet this non priority debt isn't happy :-(

 

today I had a letter from Moorcroft saying I have 7 days (now 5 due to them posting it!) to contact them with payment

or a proposal for repaying if I can't afford the full amount.

 

 

I'm still paying each month and I've asked to pay in several letters & emails to argos yet its now with Moorcroft.

 

Some of the debt is £12 charges and interest etc.,

I will write to Moorcroft and offer the £20 I'm already paying but if Argos/FRS

didn't even reply to my offer why would Moorcroft accept?

 

Please can anyone advise me what to do, many thanks

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SImple. CCA them. Dont send anything else. Keep paying argos for now ( Hope you CCA'd them too). If they cant give you a valid CCA response within 12+2 days, then you stop paying.

 

 

If moorcroft say they are acting on behalf of argos, then ignore moorcroft and get a FULL complaint going into argos. They should NOT be getting a silly DCA involved when you are already paying the debt off.

  • Confused 1

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Have Argos ceased adding charges and interest ?

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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No haven't sent of a CCA, do I need to send one to Argos and one to moorcroft?

I asked them to stop interest on my account for 6 months while i get myself sorted but they said they couldn't and then sent me the income forms to fill out, I thought by sending the doctors note was enough. I emailed a complaint to Argos and they said if I didn't fill out the income forms they couldn't help me, they wanted to know everything. Maybe I should have filled them out?

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If they will not stop interest and charges, then drop them to £1 a month. As for their income forms, ignore them. You supply a very simple budget summary. Nothing more. You certainly didnt need to send a doctors note for a stupid catalogue debt.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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when did you take the card out please?

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Argos and similar firms know that they are low on the priority list, so thats why they shout the loudest, they hope that you don't know this, and will treat them the same as Council Tax and electricity, etc

 

Sam

All of these are on behalf of a friend.. Cabot - [There's no CCA!]

CapQuest - [There's no CCA!]

Barclays - Zinc, [There's no CCA!]

Robinson Way - Written off!

NatWest - Written off!

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http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?405-Debt-Collection

 

there are plenty of draft letters in the CAG library, I have linked the section for you above. Choose one and send it to Argos. Also send the CCA request.

 

I don't think a GP's certificate will be sufficient, however, if you have made them aware of the situation and are still refusing to help, then they will look very bad should it go any further.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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think its time to take control?

 

 

TELL [dont ask] them they are only going to get £xxPCM for xx mts

as a goodwill gesture

and as a reciprocal GOGW they must freeze int & refrain from levying PENALTY charges.

if they wont

drop them to £1PCM for life.

.

as an example>

.

I am currently in financial difficulties and not able to meet my normal monthly repayments.

to show my goodwill, i am going to pay £5 for 6 mts.

 

i will update you in 6mts time or before, should my situation change.

.

could you please as a reciprocal goodwill guesture,

.

refrain from levying any penalty charges & freeze the interest on my account.?

.

Should you fail to assist me during a period of financial difficulty, contrary to all the guidelines and codes

issued by the relevent bodies and authorities that govern you and the way you conduct yourselves.

.

i shall have no alternative but to reduce my offer to £1PCM for the rest of the life of the account,

.

.

as your actions would do nothing to help me.

.

i thank you for your time.

..

.

dx

.

then pay by your internet banking site

.

and get reclaiming

.

TAKE CONTROL

.

or

if you have sent the above and they refuse

then write back........

.

.

i'm sorry, but you have failed to assist me during a period of financial difficulty, against all the guidelines and codes

issued by the relevent bodies and authorities that govern you and the way you conduct yourselves.

i repeat again, the contents of my letter dated dd/mm/yyyy, for want of clarification:

to show my goodwill, i am going to pay £XX for XX mts

could you please as a reciprocal goodwill guesture, refraining from levying any penalty charges & freeze the interest on my account.

i will update you in 6mts time or before, should my situation chance.

should you fail to help by refraining from levying unlawful PENALTY charges & freeze my interest,

i shall have no alternative but to reduce my offer to £1PCM for the rest of the life of the account,

as your actions are doing nothing to help me.

This is contrary to the rules you should operate under.

disgruntled account holder

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thankyou for your replies.

 

 

I'm struggling to understand the CCA?

 

 

I know I need to pay argos, and not disputing this,

 

 

just asking to reduce the minimum payments until I sort myself out.

 

 

Do I need to send a cca?

 

 

and would they refund the charges on my account?

 

 

sorry

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CCA is the valid credit agreement. If they cannot produce the original one plus all terms and conditions at inception and any changes, OR a valid reconstituted one, then they cant go to court, so theres no point you paying it.

 

Send the CCA request and see what they come back with. Regarding charges, that means you will need to send a SAR, and it will cost you £10.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Thankyou

 

 

 

 

so I send a CCA to both Moorcroft & argos?

 

See my post # 9 - Moorcroft is only acting on behalf of Argos, so you need to send the CCA request to Argos.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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and completely ignore moorcrap.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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had letter this morning from Moorcroft telling me that the last payment I made argos

should have been sent to them not argos and all future payment must be sent to them

and they are still waiting for me to tell them how I am going to repay,

 

 

I have 7 days to let them know.

 

 

I pay at the beginning of each month, so that payment to Argos would have made before getting letter from Moorcroft anyway.

 

Not heard anything else regarding the CCA request but they would only have got that on Monday.

 

 

Shall I just carry on paying Argos each month until I hear about the CCA?

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as already advised you ignore moorcrap

 

 

await the cca return.

 

 

12+2 working days.

 

 

is your payment due before then?

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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no cca return by then ..then no further payments necessary

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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No. You're right. The CCA goes to the company who is currently chasing you. A sar goes to the original creditor.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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sar

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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jus send the cca request to Moorcroft and argos an sar.

 

 

no need for the all guns blazing letter yet.

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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A few posts have been moved to a separate thread as they were taking this thread off course and provides no assistance to the original thread starter..

 

Here is a link to the other thread.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?441523-Kris_barb-s-thread

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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